Feast of the Holy Family

[00:00:01] Speaker A: Welcome to Faith Finding God moments in your everyday. Each week on Faith Break, hosts Karen Luke and Ann Gallagher bring spiritual refreshment to your daily life. Today's episode for December 29, 2024 celebrates the feast of the Holy family. Karen and Ann welcome special guest Dan Hofford to explore the joys and challenges of raising a family in faith in today's real world. [00:00:34] Speaker B: Hey, everybody. Welcome back. This is Faith Break, where we take a break to find our God moments in our everyday life. I am Anne Gallagher. [00:00:43] Speaker C: And I am Karen Luke. [00:00:44] Speaker B: We are co workers, friends, parents, and today we are talking about the Holy Family. And we have a special friend with us. [00:00:52] Speaker C: Yes, Deanne Hofford, who is our finance director for the parishes. Welcome. [00:00:58] Speaker B: Thank you. [00:00:58] Speaker D: Thank you for having us. Or having me. [00:01:01] Speaker B: We decided we needed a dad. Since we're talking about families today. It wouldn't be right to just have two moms. So thanks for being here. [00:01:08] Speaker D: Yeah, happy to be here. [00:01:09] Speaker B: Karen, you want to tell us your God moment? I know you had one. Ready to go? Yeah. [00:01:12] Speaker C: So my God moment in the midst of the craziness of life and politics and family and getting the kids ready for school or trying to get them ready for school. I was listening to the news on the way in the other day, and I was stopped at a light, and all of a sudden I'm like, I can't do this anymore. And I turned on Matt Mahar's in the Room. [00:01:35] Speaker B: I love that song. [00:01:36] Speaker C: Have you ever heard that song, Dan? Oh, my gosh. It is, like, my favorite thing. We'll put a little link to, like. But I just turned that on, and I drove the rest of the way to work. I was like, oh, it was just like. It was the best. It settled me. It was just, like, exactly what I needed. And I was singing so loud, I lost my voice before I got to work. Cause it was like, that loud. [00:01:59] Speaker D: You were loud. [00:02:00] Speaker C: Yeah, I know, right? I know. Yeah. All by myself in the car. It's great. I sounded perfect. [00:02:05] Speaker B: Do you embarrass your kids, like, singing in the car, or do you only sing in the car when you're alone? [00:02:10] Speaker C: Oh, no, I sing in the car with the kids. Emma has gotten to the point where she turns the radio off when we pull into the parking lot at school. Because when she opens up the door, she doesn't even want the music, even if it's low. Like, she. She turns it off. She's a brat about it. [00:02:27] Speaker B: That's so funny. [00:02:27] Speaker C: It's like as soon as she opens. [00:02:28] Speaker D: Up, like, hey, mom, can you stop here, like a block away from school? [00:02:31] Speaker C: No, no, no, no. She actually lets me drive her to the spot, which is a whole nother thing. [00:02:39] Speaker B: I hate drop off one of my youth ministers. When I was in high school, he had kids who were like in middle school or younger at the time. And he would talk about how he would like roll the windows down and play like, you know, like the adult soft rock station and like just like sing along as you pulled into the kids school pickup just to embarrass him. [00:02:56] Speaker C: On purpose for Halloween. [00:02:57] Speaker D: Elevator jazz or something. [00:02:59] Speaker C: So good for Halloween. I had a clown wig on and a spider man mask. And I picked Connor up from school on Halloween listening to crazy music. So it was great. [00:03:10] Speaker B: He was probably a good sport about it. [00:03:11] Speaker C: He loves it. Yeah. [00:03:12] Speaker B: Emma, he doesn't seem like an embarrassable person. [00:03:15] Speaker C: No. Cause he's just embarrassing. [00:03:17] Speaker B: I don't think you could embarrass him. [00:03:19] Speaker C: All right, so Anne, or should we go to Dan? [00:03:23] Speaker B: I've got one that kind of feeds off of your song, actually. Cause you talked about in the room, and that song's all about like, I just want to be in the room when it happens. Right? Like, when God moves, I want to be there and see it. And we had. So last week at youth group, one of our teens brought two friends who had never come before. They're not parishioners, they just like. He's like, can I bring two friends? I'm like, absolutely. And they came and I could tell they weren't really sure, like, what was going up, what was the vibe and stuff. But when they left, they were like, we loved it. And they came back last night and they're thinking about coming on the search retreat and NCYZ and all of our. So that was kind of a win. And I was like, you know, that's just so cool when you see a young person taking the initiative to invite somebody else and then have them come. [00:04:05] Speaker C: Back and that they like it. [00:04:07] Speaker B: That was my God moment. [00:04:08] Speaker C: That's awesome. Go, God. [00:04:10] Speaker B: Okay. [00:04:10] Speaker C: We're gonna throw you in the fire. [00:04:12] Speaker D: Yeah. Yeah. God. We were in Boston this past weekend for a. A dance convention competition for my daughter. And on the way back, it was quiet, everybody was asleep, and I had the music on and it was nice. And, you know, we've been just real busy lately, as a lot of people are. And it was a moment where I remembered where God has brought me. Where God brought me from to where I am now. [00:04:39] Speaker B: I love that. [00:04:39] Speaker D: And it was. It was just Good. It was a good reminder. [00:04:43] Speaker C: Amazing that you can be in a car with your family and it's quiet. [00:04:48] Speaker D: That in itself was almost a miracle. [00:04:50] Speaker B: Yeah. I feel like my kids are quiet in the car because they have the earbuds. Do your kids? Mine are older than yours are, but my children both have headphones in pretty much all the time, as though it's part of their body and they're listening to music or like a video or something. [00:05:08] Speaker D: Yeah. I have to fight to make that not the case. [00:05:11] Speaker B: And sometimes I don't know if they have them on or not because they have long hair. So I'm, like, talking to them, and I. They may not even be listening or hearing me. It's crazy. [00:05:21] Speaker C: We drove to Myrtle beach when Emma was like, three, two or three. And she either talked or sang or hummed the entire 17 hours we were in the car. Even if she was watching a video, she. Yeah, we got there. Luckily my in laws were there. So I'm like, here you go. And I took a mile and a half walk on the beach. I'm like, I just need to breathe. Oh, my God. [00:05:49] Speaker D: Yeah. [00:05:49] Speaker C: So no, I don't know what that's like even now. So. [00:05:54] Speaker B: Okay. So. [00:05:55] Speaker C: Holy Family. [00:05:55] Speaker B: Holy Family. Today is the feast of the Holy Family. So the first Sunday after Christmas is when we celebrate Jesus, Mary, and Joseph and what life must have been like for them as Jesus was growing up. And it is a special feast day for me because I was married on the feast of the Holy Family, and both of my children were baptized on the feast of the Holy Family. Yeah. [00:06:19] Speaker C: That's so cool. [00:06:20] Speaker B: We had a Christmas wedding. You had a Thanksgiving wedding. I don't know when your anniversary is. [00:06:26] Speaker D: February 18th. [00:06:27] Speaker C: Oh, wow. [00:06:27] Speaker B: I didn't even realize. [00:06:30] Speaker C: Oh, my gosh. [00:06:31] Speaker D: Right? [00:06:31] Speaker B: You got it right. You got it right. Luz will be happy. Yeah. So we're here to talk about how holy our families are. [00:06:40] Speaker C: That's really funny. [00:06:42] Speaker B: Yeah. Because we might work for the church, but we have the same struggles as everybody else does with raising our kids in faith and maybe even some extra struggles because, like, our kids get church as part of the package deal. [00:06:58] Speaker C: Yeah. I would say a little bit more. So I know, like, my kids don't differentiate church from my work anymore. So it's like, everything. Even if we go to church as a family, it's like, mom's working. Cause somebody's gonna tap me on the shoulder or I have to go fill up the toilet paper. Whatever it is, whatever else needs to happen. Whatever it is. But, Dan, you're not a parishioner within our parish. So how. What is. I just want to ask you, like, how is it for you? Cuz you're on a different spectrum. You work for the church, but you're not. [00:07:38] Speaker B: You're worshiping somewhere else. [00:07:39] Speaker C: You're worshiping somewhere else. [00:07:41] Speaker D: Yeah, yeah. I mean it's, it's a little bit of both. My. Yes, I, the job is more of a 9 to 5 office administrative. But I do try to treat it like a ministry job. You know, if it, if I didn't, I'd be working somewhere on paychecks or wherever. So. And, and we are also pretty involved in, in our own church and, and now, you know, we're, we're. I'm forming relationships and even my wife and kids with folks from these, these communities. So. So yeah, so. So what was your question? [00:08:18] Speaker C: How is it worshiping with your family? Like do you feel holy when you. [00:08:23] Speaker B: Do you have a hard time getting your kids to church or are you guys pretty much busy? [00:08:26] Speaker D: We keep busy. You know, that's our biggest challenge. And I think it's the challenge for a lot of people, most people nowadays especially, and they'll say a lot. That's Satan's way of trying to get us away from God to keep us busy. So yeah, we have to be intentional about that. And my daughter, fortunately our church has a really good youth group. So she likes that when she's not doing ballet or something else, she'll try to go to youth group on Wednesdays. Dom sometimes doesn't wanna go to church. [00:09:00] Speaker B: But yeah, I always, I think back to when my kids were real little and just working in youth ministry has been such a cool thing really for my family and my kids. Cause even when they were babies I would like bring them with me to retreats or you know, so I have all these great memories and even pictures of like teenagers holding my little babies. And I just think it was good for my kids to be around teenagers as they were growing up and it was good for the teenagers to be around family. And like I'm thinking of this one picture I have when Bridget is like maybe four or five and she's sitting on the lap of a teenage boy and she's talking to another teenage boy and you can tell she's just like giving them the business and they're just like smiling at her and it's just such a cool. I don't know, there's nothing that replicates church community like that, you know that there's a whole bunch of people of all ages and from all walks of life who care about my kids because they're part of this family that's bigger than our family, you know? [00:10:03] Speaker C: Well, it goes back to the whole, like, saying it takes a village to raise a family. And I really feel that that's true within our Christian faith, because we have the other families that are going through the same thing and know the struggles. And I love it. At St. Catherine's we have two baby. Okay, what I want to say is gonna sound really bad, but two older women. And they just. They'll see a baby, and they'll just go up and grab them and love them and give the parents just a breather. Because we all know what it's taken just to get into the door. [00:10:47] Speaker B: It's so hard to bring your little ones to church, especially if you're new. And I think both of Father Rob and Father Mike before him, they both are really good about having kids in church and saying to people, don't feel bad if your kid's making noise or crying or whatever. We want you here. And to have. Yeah, those families show up and just have a random parishioner be like, I mean, excited to see your kids. [00:11:11] Speaker C: It's in a good way. But, you know, it's also really good to see the all ages at all of the Masses, too. And just the welcoming aspect of that. And I love when there's a baptism at the Saturday Masses. Cause that tends to be at St. Catherine's it tends to be more adults, I guess, going, so when there is a baptism, they're all like, yay. There's super exciting, super excited. It's just like that feeling of there's more to it than just the three or four or five of us in our home. [00:11:50] Speaker B: I think, you know, it's interesting because being a parent who works for the church, I feel like I've had really positive experiences and some not so positive experiences, too. Like when Liam was born, my oldest, I was working at a different parish. And like, right in the time between when I had accepted the job at transfig, but I hadn't left the previous parish yet. I had somebody who I had sat in front of in Mass for years and say to me, you make me dizzy when you rock the baby during Mass. Like, during the music. Cause Liam loved the music. And I would like, okay, so I. [00:12:24] Speaker C: Don'T have babies anymore, and I still rock back and forth to the music. [00:12:29] Speaker B: Then when I came to transfig, Liam, by that time was like one and a half. It was like, so he was, like, right at the age where, like, he's running all over the place. You can't, like, contain him in church. And so I didn't bring him for, like, six months after I started working. I just came to mass by myself and I left Brian home with the baby. And when I finally did, though, we sat in the back and we happened to sit in front of you guys. Never got to meet them. But Jack and Mary Lou Staats were, like, founding members of the parish barn people. And I sat in front of them, and they were amazing. They, like, played with him. They were so happy he was there. And I was just like, okay, this is how it should be for everybody when they get their act together and finally bring their kid to church. Because, like, it's hard. It's not easy. It's really not easy to get out the door and get there. [00:13:22] Speaker C: I mean, it's not easy with teenagers getting out the door either. [00:13:25] Speaker B: No. For whole different reasons. [00:13:27] Speaker C: I mean, it's just. I see so many families. It's so funny. We talk about Menden and Pittsford time, where the mass has already started and there's like, nobody in church. And then all of a sudden, by the first reading, it's packed. Cause so many people are, like, finally getting in. And I'll stand back and people are like, oh, sorry. I'm like, hey, you're here. And then I'll see the teenagers come in and they're like. But they're there, right? I mean, that's what matters. It's not about if they come in sweatpants or if their hair is disheveled or whatever. It's. They're there. [00:14:08] Speaker D: We call it Hofford time in my house. [00:14:10] Speaker B: Is it 10 minutes. [00:14:12] Speaker D: And I have a hard time getting out. Even without the kids. [00:14:14] Speaker C: You're one of them. [00:14:19] Speaker B: What are some of the ways, you guys, when you think back on, like, raising your kids, where you felt you had, like, a win, like, in raising your kids in faith. You've had them. I know you have. Yeah. Like. Or maybe they were traditions when the kids were little that helped you to pass on your faith to your kids. Or. [00:14:36] Speaker D: I think for us, for me, it's the real moments. It's not, you know. Yes. So we. Our kids go to a Christian school. They go to youth group. We go to church. We do all those things. But if we're not being real at home, you know, not that. Not that. That doesn't matter, but it starts with us being real at home, not being hypocrites. Right. And they're going to do what we do and not what we tell them. Right. That's. That's how most people learn. That's how kids learn. They. They do what their parents do. And so. And so the disciplines, right. When they see us praying and reading and things like that, those are. Those are important. And I think, though, some of the most important times is when we actually humble ourselves. And we're not perfect. Yeah, we're Christians and I work at a church and all that, but like you said earlier, we're just like any other family. And when I'm cranky and angry and impatient with my wife or my kids or the world or whatever, or I fail in some way, that's okay. As long as I acknowledge that and humble myself and change. Right. [00:15:54] Speaker B: Apologizing to your kids. [00:15:55] Speaker D: Apologizing to your kids is huge. Is huge. And I think those are the moments where it really hits home for them. [00:16:04] Speaker B: I was thinking about when my kids were real little and we would always pray with them before bed. Like, did you do this with your kids? Like have special bedtime routine and your bedtime prayers that you do? And so I had a prayer that I would pray over both of my kids at bedtime. And then Brian had his own thing that he would do. And actually he still does with Bridget every night. I feel like she would be embarrassed if she knew I said that on the podcast. Cause she's in middle school. But we each had kind of our own moment with them. And the funny thing is that Brian doesn't tell. He won't tell me what he does to pray with our kids. It's like, private between them. I mean, I think I say the prayer in front of him all the time. But he's got his own thing that he does with our kids. And sometimes on very rare occasions are. Our oldest will still let us tuck him in at the end of the night whenever he's like a big teenager. You can't push those moments. But every once in a while there's an open moment and we can still get in there and do it. So I don't know. It's just. I think that was real important for us to set up is just routines of. And not even big fancy prayers, but just moments in the day. We used to say grace before dinner all the time, and somehow that fell by the wayside. But we, you know, to have those bedtime prayers. And, you know, you get in the car trip to go on a road trip, and you say a prayer when you get in the car for Safe travels or whatever. All those little things. They, like, make a difference, I think, because they weave all these God moments into the fabric of your. [00:17:42] Speaker D: Yeah, yeah. Make it into habit and planting seeds. And we do it at night. Not every night, but most majority of the nights out of the week. They've got maybe 15 to 20 memory verses that we. So I just. I quit, you know. All right. Dom John 3, 16, or Maddie, you know, so. So they're. They're building that up. And. And then in the mornings, we've been doing this prior to. We homeschooled for a couple years. So one of the nice things about that is we have a lot of time to do devotionals and prayer and things like that. And they. They get that at school. They have chapel and things like that. But it's so important that. That we. Their. Their parents do it. So now on the way to school, I will hand one of them my phone, and they'll read usually three verses of Proverbs. [00:18:34] Speaker B: In the car. [00:18:35] Speaker D: In the car. [00:18:35] Speaker B: Nice. [00:18:36] Speaker D: Okay, guys, what. What did. Which one did you like most? Or which one do you have a question about which one struck a chord? And we just talk through that and, you know, so we get. It's usually a five to ten minute conversation. But Proverbs is very, very practical stuff, so I think it's just a good way to start the day. [00:18:53] Speaker B: And good teachable moments and Christian music in the car. [00:18:58] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:18:59] Speaker B: Although I carpooled to a robotics competition with Liam last year, and I had, like, a gang of the team members in the car, and he made. He's like, mom, no Christian music, no show tunes. Like, all right, you guys are gonna be playing video games in the back, but I promise I won't. [00:19:15] Speaker C: I love the moments where, like, I feel like a win moment is when the kids will come to me with a problem and they will already have a solution based on how we are as a family, you know? Or like, we have school bucks at school, so they don't carry any cash. It's all, like, electronic. So I got a notice that it was low, and I'm like, I just put money on this so I can go and look at everything. And there were, like, multiple bags of chips each week, each day. So I was like, connor, what are you doing? He goes, mom, I was buying for my friends. We had such a good day in math. And I'm like, oh, my gosh. Around a cheese. Like a round of chips for everybody. So he's just, like, celebrating his wins with his friends. But I'm Like, I can't. I can't be mad at him because he's like. He's giving and he's sharing and being generous with my money. But, hey, you know. But it's those moments that you're like, all right, cool. Like, you can't be mad at it because it's what you have been teaching and living. And then just another quick thing, Jer and I, for our anniversary, we did a family dinner. And out of the blue, Emma tinks her glass. She goes, I'd like to pray for you, too. Because of you, we're here. And I'm like, oh, my word. But it was, like, the whole symbolism of, like, you were saying with your God moment, where we were to where we are and how it's all just. [00:21:02] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:21:03] Speaker C: Complete. Right? And, like, oh, I would have never. [00:21:07] Speaker B: Especially because our kids are all, like, older, middle school, high school ages. And, you know, one of the cool experience I was able to have as a youth minister raising kids is that we do a summer service retreat every summer where we go and stay in a convent with a family of nuns. And. Or they're not nuns. They would be very clear about that. They're, you know, apostolic sisters out in the world. But so we've stayed there for a week every year since my kids were babies. And I would bring the babies and, you know, and so all those sisters are like grandmas to my kids now. Cause they've just had this relationship over all these years. And they're amazing. Like, they're feisty, and they're just, you know, I mean, just out in the world trying to work for justice every day in sometimes pretty radical ways. And my kids have had the chance to just have these role models who, like, just don't, you know, they'll go to any extent to, like, bring the gospel and bring God's love to the people who are the most on the margins. And I think that's been really a big blessing for us. Yeah. Okay. So should we talk about the actual Holy Family? Yes. I brought something for show and tell. This is my favorite image of the Holy Family. And back when I was at a different parish, I think the artist or whoever, whatever company he's representing must have sent these to, like, every parish. Every parish. So it was in the pastoral associate's office, who was a friend of mine, and I was so drawn to this image. I would, like, go in there, and I would just be like, can I just look at that for a while? And we're like. Or can I borrow it? And I want to do this reflection thing. Can I just. And finally, she was just like, just take it. You obviously love this so much. So this was a gift from her. And what I like about it is just how intimate and human it is. And I think, especially for Catholics, we get this image of the Holy Family, and it's all like stained glass and very elevated. And I just know it wasn't like that. The things that they had to deal with were pretty tough, right. And I think Joseph and Mary had to be really connected. And I just love the. Just the love, the physical. The physicality of it and the deep love that's evident between the three of them in that sculpture. And I have several other Holy Family images up around my home, too. I kind of collect them. So I don't know, what do you guys think about when you think about Jesus and Mary and Joseph, what things might have been like for them as Jesus was growing up? [00:23:53] Speaker D: Yeah, it had to be brutal. I mean, I wake up every day and I turn on a faucet and have clean water. [00:24:00] Speaker B: Right? [00:24:00] Speaker D: It was just, you know, and we're very fortunate and very rich, right? Because there's still probably the. I don't know, the majority, but a lot of people in this world that don't have that. They live like that, but still just think about that. Having a child and a. In a barn and not at home and not having the modern medicines that we have. But, you know, Joseph is. I think he's probably, you know, when people say, what's, you know, great men of the Bible, right? You think about David and Solomon and Paul and John and all these. These guys, and. And. But Joseph really strikes a chord with me because there's really not much said about him at all. And I heard this once in a. I don't know if you've heard of the. The Bible Project. They do these YouTube lessons, and one time he. He had a term for this, but it was. It was. It was, I guess, a Jewish term or something, but it was a word that described that. How certain things were placed in the Bible because they were significant. And it got me thinking one day, you know, think about Joseph, right? Think about even today, and even though our society has changed a lot, but if. If two people were engaged right in it. And imagine. Imagine the shame that a man would feel or the embarrassment or the anger if his fiance was pregnant. Right? [00:25:36] Speaker B: Right. [00:25:36] Speaker D: Even in today's society. Now take that back 2000 years ago in that culture. I can't even fathom that what he had to go through. Right. And then to be the earthly father, but not really. And then. But. But here's what, here's what's cool about it is he's. And to me, it's like, okay, he was entrusted with raising the Son of God. That is, in my mind, the most significant man besides Jesus in the Bible. [00:26:10] Speaker B: I second that. [00:26:11] Speaker D: Yet there's virtually nothing written about him. [00:26:14] Speaker B: And we don't have any of his words. He never speaks. [00:26:17] Speaker D: And here's what that says to me. And this is an encouragement to men in today's society be insignificant. Right. And here's what I mean by that is. And I don't. You know, I went to North Park University in Chicago and the. The motto is lead lives of significance or something like that. And I love that. Right? And as Christians, we go out and. And we actually, we do want to be significant. We want to do significant things and, and share the gospel and change the world. Right. But so often our. Our hearts are led astray. And, you know, even in my job. Right. I want to do really well. And sometimes, you know, I get swelled up with pride and. And things like that. But it's like, wait, Joseph did the greatest thing that probably any man could ever do, and in the. The greatest book ever written, he's not recognized in there. Ver it. Almost. [00:27:20] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:27:21] Speaker B: Only a few verses. [00:27:22] Speaker D: A few verses. So to me, it's like, you know what? I need to not worry so much about what people think about me. I need to not worry so much about the mark. I'm going to leave my legacy and just be humble and do my job as a dad, as a husband. As a husband, and then as a dad, and then as a friend. Right. And not worry about what gets recorded, not worry about what people see. That's what I mean by be insignificant. You want to be significant, but in a way that you're not worried about being remembered for being significant. [00:28:01] Speaker B: When we were talking about the ways we prayed over our kids and how we tried to model faith for them rather than tell them what to do. I mean, you look at the person that Jesus grew into, and it didn't come from nowhere. We know he was fully human and fully divine, but we don't know how he came into that identity. Like, he must have grown into it somehow. And he did that with the guidance of his parents. Like, they gave him what he needed to be the person he needed to be that God wanted him to be. Like, it's so. Yeah. Like, that's the legacy. Right? [00:28:34] Speaker D: Right. [00:28:35] Speaker B: He raised Jesus Right. It's kind of a big deal. [00:28:37] Speaker D: He got the gold medal. [00:28:39] Speaker B: Right. [00:28:40] Speaker D: Without getting the gold medal. He achieved the gold medal without getting the gold medal. [00:28:44] Speaker C: And here I think parenting is hard. [00:28:47] Speaker B: Yeah. Right. Mary and Joseph didn't have to deal with phones and the Internet, but. [00:28:52] Speaker C: No. But they had to deal with losing them. No. [00:28:56] Speaker B: Well, we were thinking. When I think about Joseph, I think about how he led his family through hard decisions. Cause he was the one. I mean, like, Mary was totally. I mean, intimately close with God, too. I don't. We're going to talk about her, too. But for Joseph, like, he had all these dreams, right? Like, he had dreams. He had. At first, he had a dream that told him to stand by Mary, and then he had a dream that told him to take his family and go to Egypt. And then he had a dream that told him to bring them back. And when I think of the discernment and the trust that, like, what his personal relationship with God must have been, that he could. He could receive those movements, those nudges from God and just have faith to. [00:29:49] Speaker D: Do what he needed to do and crazy stuff, right? [00:29:52] Speaker B: It's insane. [00:29:53] Speaker D: Hey, marry your wife even though she's pregnant, right? Hey, the king is going to kill you if you don't leave. Right? And imagine what people must be saying, dude, you're crazy. What are you talking about? Why would you marry that woman? What, you're going to flee because somebody's. King Herod wants to kill your child? Dude, get off your high horse. [00:30:14] Speaker B: Egypt wasn't like, next door. It was way too. [00:30:16] Speaker D: That was a track. That was a track. [00:30:18] Speaker C: And it's interesting, as we were conversing, I was just thinking all the moments of Joseph that we know of. He's sleeping. [00:30:29] Speaker B: Holy napping. [00:30:30] Speaker C: Holy napping. Yeah. Going back to holy napping. [00:30:33] Speaker D: But so maybe that could be part of our jobs, right? [00:30:37] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:30:39] Speaker D: Rob, I'm gonna go home and take a nap. [00:30:42] Speaker B: I have the communal nap couch in my office that people can't sleep. [00:30:46] Speaker C: We were actually talking to Rob about this a couple weeks ago when we were talking about our Advent podcast, and Holy Napping came up, and with everything that he's been doing, I'm like, you know, holy napping is okay. You can do it, and it's okay. So we've already told them about it. So I'm sure if we're at our desks, Holy napping. It'll be okay. [00:31:11] Speaker D: I've used the couch once or twice. [00:31:12] Speaker B: Yeah, I know. It's for everybody. [00:31:15] Speaker C: Well, I am not a big Fan of scripture passages of what it means to be a family or how to parent. Cause it's very old school. [00:31:27] Speaker B: Oh, yeah. When we were prepping for this episode, Karen's like, I'm gonna go see what the Bible has to say about parenting. [00:31:33] Speaker C: Don't. Don't do it. Because it's all like, Old Testament, spare. [00:31:37] Speaker B: The rod, spoil the church, spare the rod. [00:31:39] Speaker C: If you. You know, it's just. It's not. It's not healthy, Right? [00:31:44] Speaker B: So maybe. Well, like Dan was saying before, they don't do what we say, they do what we do. [00:31:50] Speaker C: Yeah. Okay. [00:31:51] Speaker B: So maybe, like, what did the Holy Family do? [00:31:53] Speaker C: Yeah, but I went to Pope Francis. [00:31:56] Speaker B: Okay. [00:31:57] Speaker C: So I'm not even looking at the Bible right now, but I found. I know, I know. I'm just say it. But I. I love Pope Francis. He has a quote that perfect families don't exist. [00:32:13] Speaker B: That's true. [00:32:14] Speaker C: That's like the quote. And it says, going further. Perfect families do not exist. They must not discourage us, though. Quite the opposite. Love is something we learn. Love is something we live. Love grows, and it is forged by the concrete situations with each particular family experiences. Love is born and constantly develops amid lights and shadows. And love can flourish in men and women who try not to make conflict the last word, but rather a new opportunity. And I was like, ah, you know, like the season of adventure, waiting, hope this new opportunity. Every day is a new day, a new beginning. And I'm sure the Holy Family, we think is perfect, but I'm sure that they had their struggles in their moments. [00:33:13] Speaker B: The Church talks about how the family is the school for holiness. And I think that is, like, spot on because it's where you're tested the most. Right. The people you're closest to are the ones you're gonna have the fewest masks with. And they're gonna see all of you, right. Not just the Christmas card. Perfect image. They're gonna see you like. So this episode's gonna air, you know, two days after Christmas or, well, a couple days after Christmas, and everybody's still gonna be home for the holidays, which is fantastic. But you know how when you've been home with your family for a bit and you're all kind of like. So I think viewers and listeners to just keep in mind that, yeah, no, there's no such thing as a Holy Family. But also, all families are holy, right? And they're where we kind of hone our skills of holiness because we have to practice. We have to practice what it means to be loving. [00:34:10] Speaker C: Have you ever Liked when it's dizzy. Have you ever picked up your kid from the babysitter or school and they're like, oh my gosh, he was so great today. He's so sweet. And he's, you know. Or she's this and that. And you're thinking like, who are you talking about? [00:34:25] Speaker D: My kid? [00:34:26] Speaker C: Right. I mean, I've multiple times. And it's because they feel most comfortable with us that they can let it all just go. And I remember picking up my kids from school and they just, they were holding it in for so long, like any anger and angst and frustration. And then when we get home and I'm like, oh, it's gonna be perfect. I'm gonna make dinner, we're gonna sit and do homework. And it's like it all comes out. [00:34:52] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:34:53] Speaker C: Just remember Pope Francis and the Holy Family just. [00:35:00] Speaker B: We're gonna talk about the story of the twelve year old Jesus in the temple in next week's episode. So I'm gonna. Which is the only story we have about Jesus as a child slash teenager. Right. But I just think that Jesus relationship with his mother must have been something really special. And I want to mention, speaking of scripture, the wedding at Cana story, which is so like the stories we have about the Holy family, like we have the infancy narrative in Matthew, which is kind of from Joseph's point of view. We've got the kings and all that stuff with the flight to Egypt and then the Luke infancy narrative is more focused on Mary and we've got the annunciation of Gabriel and we've got the visitation with Elizabeth and the shepherds and angels, and the presentation in the temple and the finding in the temple when he's 12. And Mark doesn't even have any stories about Jesus before he starts his public before his baptism. But in John we have the beginning of Jesus. Public ministry happens at the wedding at Cana. I think it's in John 2. And it's so fascinating to me how this comes. Cause like Mary's at a wedding and Jesus and Mary are guests at this wedding and they run out of wine. And Mary's like, hang on, I'm gonna talk to my son about this. And she's like, jesus, there's no wine. And he's like, it's not my time, mom. And then she tells the stewards, just do whatever Jesus tells you to do. Right? And I just start funny. She's like, yeah, it's your time. Like, come on, you know, like you're 33 years old. It's time to start your ministry. But, like, it just seems like so, like such a natural thing when I think about my kids and the back and forth that we have with them. And again, just like a very human moment, you know? Cause, like, think about it from Jesus, like, he waited a long time to start his ministry. Like, 30 years old back then was not. Like, he wasn't a young adult. He was an older adult or midlife adult or whatever. [00:37:14] Speaker C: Midlife. [00:37:15] Speaker B: And so, first of all, she believed he could do it. She knew he could do it. And even though he. I don't know. Do we want to say he wasn't sure. Do we want to say he needed a little bit of encouragement? But she, you know, it was funny. [00:37:32] Speaker D: She was almost like, yeah, I know you're the son of God, but I'm your mother. [00:37:34] Speaker B: Right. [00:37:35] Speaker C: So, yeah, do it. [00:37:36] Speaker D: Okay. [00:37:37] Speaker B: Yeah. Because I said so. Right. Whatever, you know, I just love it, so. But again, like, that's a moment when he's an adult. But, like, you think about all the moments that led up to that, the years and years. And, you know, if. Because we don't hear from Joseph after Jesus's, you know, early, early life, we think maybe he was not around. Maybe he died or something. Like, he's not around for the crucifixion the way that Mary is around for the crucifixion. So Jesus must have had to take care of her. Right. He learned the family business and he was in the same town for all those years. [00:38:16] Speaker C: She's become that head of the household role. [00:38:20] Speaker B: And even from the cross. Even from the cross was taking care of his mother when he told John to take her. [00:38:28] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:38:29] Speaker B: I mean, yeah, I think we can relate to that too, as parents. But also children who have parents who are getting older, you know, they desire to take. You're caring for your kids, you're also caring for your parents. Like, it's a lot. [00:38:42] Speaker C: Mm. I'm going back to the chosen. [00:38:46] Speaker B: Of course you are. [00:38:47] Speaker D: I know. I've been thinking as we talk about these things, I keep thinking about that. It's a good illustration. [00:38:51] Speaker C: Yeah. The Wedding at Cana is what popped in my head. And just the. I love that show because it just shows the humanness of it. Like, you can read it, but, like, just putting. I don't even wanna say characters, but people's faces and just everything. Yeah. And that's exactly what you could see, that mother, son relationship there. And he's like, no, not yet. And she's like, come on. You know, and it's just so if you haven't watched it, I don't know why, because I've been saying it for three years. But yeah. And they were so close in age. We also have to remember that, you know, they were only about 14, 15 years apart. [00:39:41] Speaker D: Yeah, that's true. [00:39:42] Speaker C: So, like, crazy Mary was probably our age during the time of when Jesus died. [00:39:48] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, Yeah. [00:39:50] Speaker D: I was 35 when I had my first child. So, yeah, I could have been grandparent. [00:39:57] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:39:58] Speaker D: In those terms. Or a great grandparent, almost practically. [00:40:01] Speaker C: Yeah. So, I mean, when we talked about our kids and the teenagers at youth group, you know, it had to have been like that with Mary and Jesus. Just that relationship was probably very different than any other mother and son because of the. The age and their mission and everything. [00:40:30] Speaker B: Do you guys have any final thoughts about raising children in faith or about the holy Family before we sign off? [00:40:40] Speaker C: Come to church with them. Just do it. You got plenty of people to help. And once we model, it'll just become. The younger you do it, it just becomes more natural. And that's what I tell all the families that come for baptism. Like, don't just come for baptism and then show up when they're in first grade because they don't have that understanding then. So pray over them. [00:41:11] Speaker D: Yeah. And, you know, I think Jesus wants. He doesn't want. I tell our kids this all the time. My daughter likes to be perfect. Sometimes I say, we don't. We don't expect perfection. I actually have to tell her sometimes to stop studying. [00:41:25] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:41:26] Speaker D: And go to bed. I'm like, you get good grades. You're doing well. Like, go to bed, get some rest. Or when she makes a mistake and she feels really guilty, I said, maybe, you know, okay, yeah, there might be some consequences or this or that, but we still love you. But my point is perfection. Right? And we tell him, you know, Jesus doesn't want us to be perfect. He wants your heart. And so that'd be my advice. You know, just, the disciplines are good, and we need the disciplines, but just, he wants your heart. [00:42:07] Speaker B: I was thinking about my mentor, one of my mentors in youth ministry, Michael, who's also a mentor and a role model in parenting for me. When I was in high school, he was the head of the diocesan youth ministry, and he told me that. And actually, he was still in that job when I was a baby youth minister. So I had, you know, many years of learning from him, and he said the same thing as a parent and as a youth minister, that we're in the business of making memories. And I think that's really important to remember that it's those small moments that we give our kids the memories of being at church, of praying as a family, of when things are difficult. You know, we take care of each other and we love each other. The memories are important not just because they're good memories or fun memories, but because they form our identity. Right. Like, did you guys watch Inside out, the movie? [00:43:01] Speaker C: Yes. And I finally saw the second one, so there's. And I bawled again. [00:43:05] Speaker B: So the idea of, like, the core memories, the idea that we all have, like, core memories that, like, make up the. The pillars of our personality moving forward, I thought was really smart. And if we can just as parents or as ministers in the church, youth ministers, create good memories of our kids practicing faith in imperfect ways, in real life ways, then that's. That's all we can do. We're giving them the tools they need to become who God wants them to be. [00:43:31] Speaker C: Well, Dan, thanks for coming on. [00:43:34] Speaker D: Thanks for having me. [00:43:36] Speaker C: How was it? Good. [00:43:37] Speaker D: A little nervous, but we're nervous, too. We got the wiggles out. [00:43:41] Speaker C: We thank you for. [00:43:42] Speaker B: Thanks for being our first guest. [00:43:44] Speaker C: Yeah, I was the first. You are the first guest. Congratulations. [00:43:47] Speaker D: I feel special now. All right, you did it. [00:43:50] Speaker B: We wish all of you a very happy holidays. Christmas is over, but we know many of you guys are snuggling up at home still. [00:44:00] Speaker C: Well, Christmas Day is over. [00:44:01] Speaker B: Christmas day is over. We are still in the Christmas season right until the baptism of the Lord in a few weeks. [00:44:08] Speaker C: So keep those trees up. [00:44:10] Speaker B: Yes. Enjoy your families and be holy. [00:44:16] Speaker C: Which we already are. [00:44:18] Speaker B: Which we already are. Have a great week, everybody. [00:44:20] Speaker C: Thanks, everybody. Bye. [00:44:21] Speaker A: Thanks for taking a faith break with us today. Karen, Luke and Anne Gallagher are lay ministers with the parishes of Saint Catherine of Siena in Menden, New York, and Church of the Transfiguration in Pittsford, New York. Thanks to our special guest today, Dan Hofford. More about our parishes, including weekly live streamed Sunday mass, can be found at stcath.org or transfiguration pittsford.org Engineering Today is by Jeff Beckett. Join us for new episodes of Faith Break in Studio on YouTube or on your favorite podcast or music applied.