[00:00:01] Speaker A: Welcome to Faith Break. Finding God moments in your everyday. Each week on Faith Break, hosts Karen, Luke, and Ann Gallagher bring spiritual refreshment to your Daily Life. It's April 13th, Passion Sunday.
Today, Karen and Anne, welcome special guest Deacon Eric Bissette to reflect on the graces of Deep Holy Week. Prayer, the meaning of the cross, and Jesus. Incredible love for each of us.
[00:00:41] Speaker B: Hi, everyone. Welcome to Faith Break. I am Karen.
[00:00:45] Speaker C: And I am Anne.
[00:00:46] Speaker B: And we have a very special guest with us today to talk to us about a little more insightfulness to Palm Sunday.
[00:00:56] Speaker C: Yeah. And Holy Week. So this is our friend, Deacon Eric Bissette. He is one of our deacons here, actually. Guess now you're our only deacon, because we just lost Kevin.
[00:01:04] Speaker D: I am the last man standing.
[00:01:07] Speaker C: Well, shout out to Kevin if he's listening. We love you, Kevin.
[00:01:11] Speaker D: I miss you already.
[00:01:12] Speaker C: He is our only deacon for our two parishes, and we love to talk to Eric as often as we can.
Among many other things around the parish, you run our RCIA program, work with baptism families at Transfig.
[00:01:30] Speaker D: Spiritual Direction.
[00:01:31] Speaker C: Spiritual direction. For the 19th annotation, I'm on the.
[00:01:35] Speaker D: Peace and Justice Committee. I'm on the liturgy committee.
I mean, I just love doing stuff for the church.
[00:01:41] Speaker B: And wonderful homilist.
[00:01:42] Speaker C: Yep. And our favorite homilist.
[00:01:44] Speaker D: Well, that's always an acquired taste.
[00:01:49] Speaker C: So we asked Eric to come and talk to us about Palm Sunday because it's kind of a hard one. And so we're pulling in the big guns.
We've, you know, made it through these weeks. Five weeks of Lent, and we're heading into the home stretch towards Easter now.
So this episode will drop on Palm Sunday. This is the start of Holy Week, and for Catholics, this is like the World Series of Liturgies. Right.
[00:02:19] Speaker B: I'm so proud of you for using a sports analogy.
[00:02:23] Speaker D: This is the Masters. Right? Let's go.
[00:02:25] Speaker C: The Masters. Golf.
[00:02:26] Speaker D: Let's do a little golf analogy since I'm here.
[00:02:29] Speaker C: Yeah. So this year, we'll be reading Luke's Passion on Palm Sunday because we're in the lectionary cycle. C. And on Good Friday, we always hear John's Passion. So those are the two we'll be hearing at our liturgies.
[00:02:43] Speaker D: And my wife is always like, why do we need to do that twice?
[00:02:47] Speaker C: I know it is hard to get through even once in a week.
[00:02:49] Speaker D: It's such a long pat. You would think one time, you know, and really focus on it would be great.
[00:02:54] Speaker C: But every time I need to prepare something related to Palm Sunday, and I want to focus on the readings. It's even hard to sit and read it and reflect on it in one piece.
[00:03:06] Speaker D: You would think one reading could give you enough reflection for a month.
[00:03:11] Speaker C: Like to take it in scenes or videos.
[00:03:13] Speaker D: Yeah. Without even reading it again. Right.
[00:03:15] Speaker B: But I think the liturgies are different.
[00:03:17] Speaker C: That when you're hearing it.
[00:03:19] Speaker B: When you're hearing it, the whole atmosphere is different. Like on Palm Sunday, I have a total different reaction or environment than we do for Good Friday with venerating the cross. And, like, I feel like Good Friday is more deeper and spiritual, prayerful, more silent. Palm Sunday. Yeah. Palm Sunday is like, all right, we're just gearing up for.
[00:03:46] Speaker C: And I guess now that I think of it, there is sort of a practice indignation prayer where you repeat an exercise. Right.
[00:03:52] Speaker D: Yeah, that's true. That is a long piece of scripture.
[00:03:54] Speaker C: That is a long piece of scripture.
[00:03:55] Speaker D: To do a repetition with. Yes.
[00:03:57] Speaker C: It's like two full chapters, basically.
[00:03:59] Speaker D: Normally it's just a couple lines, but, yeah, I get you.
[00:04:02] Speaker B: And then you get the priests that make you stand for the entire time. And then the nice priest just says, you may sit down.
[00:04:10] Speaker D: Thank you, Lord.
[00:04:13] Speaker C: Okay. Yes.
[00:04:14] Speaker D: First of all, I want to say something as part of an introduction for this whole faith break. And when you two are here and when I used to see you with Vicki, I gotta tell you, one of the things that I always immediately go to is kind of my deep sadness that you're not preaching and that women don't preach in the church, because I really do. And I don't know if I'm gonna get myself in trouble with this, but it's not like a theological thing. Right. It's just a discipline, a practice, and a doctrine. But I feel our church misses out so much when we take half of the faithful and not allow them to preach. Because I think just in listening to you two and listening to Vicki, you bring such a different perspective, some wonderful insights, and just some great gifts to the church. So I hope that someday we will realize, especially given the overall state of Catholic preaching, that someday we'll realize that if somebody has the charism and they've got the desire and God calls them to do that, and they've got the, you know, education, let's let them do it.
[00:05:27] Speaker B: And you'll help me write my homilies then, right?
[00:05:29] Speaker D: I don't know if you want that, but anyway, so I always. Whenever I watch your, you know, your videos or your podcasts, that's almost like the first thing I think of.
[00:05:38] Speaker C: Thanks, Eric.
[00:05:39] Speaker B: That's Very sweet.
[00:05:39] Speaker C: We're gonna take that as a compliment.
[00:05:41] Speaker D: It is a compliment. It is a compliment.
It's a gift that the church just fails to open. And I pray all the time that she will do that someday. So, anyway, so I wanted to start out with that.
[00:05:55] Speaker C: I think he just gave me my God moment for the day.
[00:05:57] Speaker B: I was just thinking that at the.
[00:05:59] Speaker D: Beginning of information there for you.
[00:06:02] Speaker C: Well, why don't we start with that? Because that's actually, I think as someone who preaches regularly, I think and it just. As people who work in the church and as Catholics in general, we are always trying to find those God moments in our everyday. That's kind of like what we talk about every week on our podcast. And as a preacher, you can. You have the opportunity to share those with our whole, you know, congregation. So we have a practice where we start every episode by just checking in with each other and seeing what was your. Where was a moment, an ordinary moment in your life in the last week or so where you felt, you know, that God was with you.
[00:06:35] Speaker D: So are you two gonna go first so I can get some examinations?
[00:06:38] Speaker C: Why don't you go first?
[00:06:39] Speaker D: Here's 30 seconds to think about it.
[00:06:40] Speaker C: Yeah, sorry. We should have strung that out.
[00:06:42] Speaker B: So I know that we aren't supposed to boast about good deeds that we have done, but.
And I'm not boasting about it. It was a very wonderful teachable moment for my kids and a beautiful God moment of community. So Connor and Emma and I were out to lunch at a fast food restaurant, and there were two homeless guys in warming up because it was one of the cold weekends.
And they were just talking. And the whole time I'm thinking, oh, my gosh, I'm so blessed to have a house and clothes and, you know, all this stuff that we go through. And so after we ate, I went up to him and I said, you guys hungry? Would you like something to eat? And I'm like, oh, that would be wonderful. Thank you. So I went up and I ordered, and we're sitting there and Connor looks at me and he goes, that was very nice of you, Mom. And I said, well, we try to help others, you know, And I'm explaining it. And he goes, I hope to grow up just like you.
[00:07:52] Speaker C: And I'm like, oh, my gosh, Melting heart.
[00:07:56] Speaker B: Not only was it a teachable moment, but it was such like, it was just, I am, you know, what Francis said, preach the gospel and if necessary, use words. And that's just the moment. I was just like, all Right. This is where. And I didn't do anything for other. Other than, you know. So then kind of looks at me and goes, are you gonna tell dad? And I'm like, well, first of all, dad would be mad if I did. But you're not. And I explained, like, we do things not to get that affirmation. But it was just the sweetest thing that he just. He took that moment to appreciate what was happening as well. So that was my God moment.
[00:08:34] Speaker C: Cool.
[00:08:34] Speaker D: How old is he?
[00:08:36] Speaker B: He's a love lovin lovin' I think.
[00:08:39] Speaker D: That'S the age where you take those whenever you can get them.
[00:08:41] Speaker C: Oh, yeah, tomorrow.
[00:08:43] Speaker D: Mom could be an idiot.
[00:08:44] Speaker C: I know. Yeah, that's totally true, because I'm definitely an idiot.
Mine are 14 and 17.
[00:08:52] Speaker B: That is the age we know nothing. And what is besides Eric's nice affirmation from us? Do you have an I do.
[00:08:59] Speaker C: So it was actually the senior high youth group meeting last night. We had special guests. So we had three of the Sisters of St. Joseph come, and we've been doing a series where we were talking about vocation. So, like, Father Rob came and talked about his priestly vocation. And then we had married people's panel the previous weekend. Then last week, we had three sisters come who. And they're the ones we stay with over the summer when we do our service retreat week. And it just happened that we had the largest attendance we've had all year in the youth room. So the room was packed, and, like, over half of them had never met or spoken to a sister before and had, like, no idea that they were so cool. And they definitely had no idea how cool these particular sisters are. And so they just had it. The sisters talked about how they came to, you know, which three sisters it was Sister Marilyn and Sister Donna and Sister Barb.
[00:09:51] Speaker D: Oh. Oh, wonderful.
[00:09:52] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:09:52] Speaker C: Yes, I know, right? So it was just a delightful conversation. It was really fun. And just to see the teens, you know, have this whole, like, new lifestyle just, like, they didn't even know about. Just open up to them.
[00:10:06] Speaker B: That's awesome.
[00:10:07] Speaker C: And I had the foresight to make the permission slips for a summer service retreat ahead of time. And so a bunch of them took them on the way out.
[00:10:13] Speaker B: So I think we're gonna have a cool look at you.
[00:10:15] Speaker D: I love it when the kids are getting involved and getting psyched, and that's wonderful.
[00:10:20] Speaker C: All right, your turn, Eric.
[00:10:22] Speaker D: Okay. My God moment. Well, one, I think I'm blessed because we mentioned they do spiritual direction. Right. So I think I really get to have a God moment every week when I meet with my directee or directees, because I actually spiritually direct a few people. And, you know, that's a. You've done the spiritual exercises, right? And you have.
[00:10:42] Speaker B: Yeah, I did.
[00:10:43] Speaker D: So you know that when you're in. When you're in that space, it's like a very sacred space. Right. So every one of it's not just a God moment, it's like a God hour. Right. And so I really love that. But something that really comes to my head is, you know, I also do rcia, and so I only have one candidate going through this year.
[00:11:02] Speaker C: Can you explain what RCIA is in case people don't.
[00:11:05] Speaker D: Oh, RCIA is the Rite of Christian Initiation of Adults, which I think has gotten changed to ocia, the Order of Christian Initiation of Adults. Whatever. I always say RCIA out of habit. But that's the process where anyone who wants to become Catholic receiving all the sacraments goes through this process of learning more about the faith. It could be somebody that's unbaptized, which would be a catechumen, or it could be somebody that was baptized Catholic and maybe received one of the sacraments, but maybe never received them all. And so it's this wonderful process where we meet for seven or eight months and learn more about the faith and hopefully give them an even greater hunger to come into the church and to grow closer to Christ. I went through the process, so it's a very back in my agnostic.
So it's always been very near and dear to my heart. So, I mean, I just love it. And I always love the fact that the church takes eight or nine months to prepare somebody so that you're fully aware of what you're getting into. Right. This isn't a sign of slip outside the church and you're in and a member of the church. This is like, we're going to tell you what we're all about. The good, the bad, the ugly, the warts. And then you decide prayerfully whether this is a church you wanna become a part of.
[00:12:28] Speaker B: And can I just say, I'm always jealous of those that go through RCIA because they're like, yearning. And their hunger for learning is so different than cradle Catholics and their attentiveness to the Mass and the sacraments. It just is. It's so beautiful.
[00:12:50] Speaker D: Yeah. They always become some of the most active members of the church. And I think it's also. I always tell them it's a blessing for them because they get to learn everything kind of from an adult perspective, so we can talk about all the nuances. You know, if the church is going through some ugly tire or something bad happened, we can discuss it and really flesh out what that means. And the fact that the church is a very human church and all those kinds of problems, which I love because I always tell them, bishops, priests, us deacons, we're human people, right? Sometimes we have bad days or we say something stupid and hurtful. And it always breaks my heart when somebody leaves the church because they happen to run into somebody like that. I always tell my candidates, if you're in the church long enough, I guarantee you at some point you're going to run into a bishop, a priest, a deacon, a nun, a woman religious, somebody who works for the church that is going to treat you in a jerky kind of way, and not because they're jerks. Maybe they're just having a bad day, Maybe they're stressed. There could be a lot going on, but it's going to happen.
That person in that moment in time does not represent the entirety of what the church is about. So it's those kinds of things that we can discuss as adults so that when they come into the church, they're fully prepared. We're like kids. We kind of have to do a green light, red light, right? Like, this is good, this is bad. You know, like Eucharist, right? When they're doing First Communion at first grade, how much can they really absorb on, like, the beautiful mystery of this, where when I discuss it with the RCIA candidates, we can get into what it means and the beauty of it?
And the guy that's going through this year, he is. He cannot wait.
[00:14:37] Speaker C: Yeah, I was actually. He's my neighbor, Hunley, lives around the block, and he's been in Mass every week for years and years. I had no idea he actually wasn't.
[00:14:47] Speaker D: So anyways, my God moment, My God moment relates to him. So we were at RCIA last week, and his wife Patty, her sister is boy, typical male thing. I don't quite have, like, she's got brain cancer. Stage four brain, some kind of cancer. I'm not 100% sure it's brain cancer, but something that's, like, weighing very heavily on her heart. And so it was wonderful to be able to grab a. You know, St. Catherine's has the prayer shawls, right? So I grabbed the prayer shawl, filled it out for her, for her sister. Gave it to Patty at the. At our last RCIA meeting, she was in tears. We're all, you Know, you just. You know, when that happens, you just feel like the love of Christ, the.
[00:15:37] Speaker C: Grace and the community.
[00:15:38] Speaker D: Yeah. And to me, it's always greater than the sum of its parts. Right, Right. Obviously, I feel, you know, very sad for her and her sister, but yet I have the joy and the hope of our faith. I know what she's feeling. I know what Huntley's feeling. Art Roberts happened to be there, you know, because we were talking about marriage, sacrament. But I always felt like when I handed her that shawl, that all this that was going on between the four of us, that God was there, and that makes it even greater than the sum of the parts, if that makes sense. Right. And that's where you just, like, sit in the grace and you're like, oh, this is where. This is where, you know, God is here and God is with us. And all those. All those things we kind of like to say glibly.
[00:16:21] Speaker C: Right.
[00:16:22] Speaker D: But that's. That's our, like, opportunity, like, to feel it in our heart and know, okay, this is what keeps us going. Right.
[00:16:28] Speaker C: That's what we're trying to do. Name those grace moments so we can keep putting them together.
[00:16:33] Speaker D: And then we store them up.
[00:16:34] Speaker C: Store them up.
[00:16:35] Speaker D: Right. Because we all run into those times where we're going to have doubts or things aren't going good or we're pissed at the church about something and you're, you know, and to me, that's when we.
[00:16:45] Speaker B: That's where we realize we unlock it.
[00:16:46] Speaker D: Pull it out and remember it. Okay. This is. This is what we're really about.
So.
[00:16:52] Speaker C: Good. So that was my.
So we asked you to come for the Palm Sunday episode partly because we have talked several times in passing about Ignatian spirituality and the 19th annotation and how our parish offers that. But we've never really kind of gotten too far into it. And so that might be something that's new to people who are listening or watching. So I wonder if you could talk a little bit about what we mean when we say the Spiritual exercises or the 19th, and then especially, like, how the third week connects with Holy Week.
[00:17:25] Speaker D: I will do what you. Since both of you have participated in this, you can chime in with anything, I think.
[00:17:30] Speaker C: Fair enough.
[00:17:31] Speaker D: Anything you think I'm missing or. Okay. So, as you know, the Spiritual Exercises are from Saint Ignatius of Loyola, and they were designed. I think they were. I don't know if they were initially designed for priests or whatever, but it's really a way for people to grow closer to Christ through prayer and Praying over Scripture. Right. And so the Ignatian Exercises are.
It's a series of prayers that go over 30 weeks where you pray over some scripture daily. You work up to an hour of prayer, which sounds daunting at first.
[00:18:08] Speaker B: We've already explained. I have already explained how that works.
[00:18:11] Speaker D: Yeah, that is daunting. So you do this prayer every day over reading scripture and then you meet with a spiritual director, which was that sacred moment I was talking about.
And it's just Ignatius has a unique way of praying, imaginative and contemplative prayer, where you're not just reading the scripture and kind of reflecting on it from a theological or historical point of view, but you're actually in many cases inserting yourself into the scene.
[00:18:41] Speaker C: With your imagination.
[00:18:42] Speaker D: Yeah, with your imagination. So, you know, at the birth of Jesus, you're there at the manger and maybe you're talking to Joseph and asking him how he feels. I remember when I was talking to a directee once and they were describing the scene, they were like hanging out in the back, right. And as a spiritual director, I could ask them, like, why aren't you up front? Right. What started to come out was their feelings of unworthiness, like they did so, like that. It's just like this really cool, cool, cool way of praying. And for me, I think what I also discovered, and this might be new for a lot of Catholics, what I think it taught me is that listening is more important in prayer than talking. And I think very often as Catholics, we want to talk. We want to pray the rosary or we want some liturgy the hours or something that we're constantly kind of yakking. But I think the Spiritual Exercises want us to slow us down and say, okay, you can do that. But then when you're done, I want you to just take some time and listen and listen to what God says.
[00:19:52] Speaker B: Are you sure you haven't listened to us before?
We talk about holy napping a lot.
[00:19:57] Speaker D: Oh, yeah. Okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
So to me, that is what the Spiritual Exercises are all about. And the 19th annotation, which is what most of us experience because the Exercises were originally set up to be a 30 day retreat where retreat and would pray five hours a day and meet with their spiritual director every night. So that was. And I believe that's what the Jesuits have to do before they make their final vows. Yeah, yeah. It's intense. Intense. So the 19th annotation, which is an adaption of that, was set up for us and for people that are working or for people at church where Instead of doing it over 30 days, you do it over 30 weeks. Instead of five hours a day, you're praying an hour a day over the seven days of the week. And then meeting with your spiritual director once. And I think that's the other cool thing with the prayer is by having a spiritual director. Director to be able to share what's happening in your prayer. And so many times directees tell me that they love it because they're so afraid to talk about their faith in other aspects of their life, whether it's with their family or at work. There's really no safe space to talk about God and how God may be talking to them or influencing their life. And when they've got that kind of hour with that spiritual director, you know, hopefully we've built up the trust and, you know, they're free to talk about their. Their hopes, their dreams, their fears, their doubts. You know, all that stuff that is, like, coming out of their prayer. And I think it's just, like, so beautiful. And I'm glad our church has it. And I would encourage anybody, if you have the time and you feel called. It's just such a wonderful way to grow closer to Christ. And I feel very blessed that I did that before I even started my diaconal ministry. Right. Because it has given me a foundation.
[00:21:56] Speaker C: That's part of what led you to your diaconal ministry?
[00:22:00] Speaker D: No. Being a deacon wasn't even a blip on my screen before I did the spiritual.
[00:22:06] Speaker C: I don't know if you're recommending it to people who are listening to it or not, but. Yeah. So if anybody is interested in that, connect with us. We can put you in touch with Bob Mulnickle, who is coordinating the effort for the spiritual exercises at our parishes. And I think he's creating the list for next year.
[00:22:24] Speaker D: Yeah. And it's getting popular. I think he actually had more people this year that wanted to do it than he had spiritual directors available. So it's cool.
[00:22:32] Speaker B: Yeah. And even if you're too busy, that's when you should do it, Right?
[00:22:38] Speaker D: Yeah. There's almost never a good time.
[00:22:40] Speaker B: There's never a good time because I.
[00:22:41] Speaker D: Think you too, probably. I remember when. And I was in the very first class that Damian did, and I remember when she tapped Marlene and I on the shoulder and said, hey, I think this would be really good for you. And she's describing it, and I'm thinking, yeah, yeah, that really sounds good. And then she got into the hour of prayer a day, and we're like, well, because our kids were teenagers at that point. Right. Life was busy and things were going on, and, boy, an hour a day, I just deal. Like, I could not figure out or I could not imagine where I was going to get that hour from. But once you start to get into it, you make the time, right. It's important enough, and then you start to miss it when you don't do it. Right.
[00:23:20] Speaker C: Right.
[00:23:20] Speaker D: I mean, yeah, it's just. I mean, God, I think that's just such a beautiful opportunity for God to work in our lives and our hearts. So it's really cool. So, yeah. Anybody interested?
Obviously, I highly recommend it.
[00:23:34] Speaker C: Can you share a little bit about the four different movements of the retreat and.
[00:23:37] Speaker D: Yeah, yeah. So the way the exercises work. And by the way, I should also say I love the fact that it's called exercises, right? Because, you know, I think prayer, like, anything is something that you have to do every day to kind of get better at it and to do it longer or, like, it's almost like a training, right? Like, if you're gonna run a marathon, you know, you go out, or if you want to get in shape, you go out and you try to exercise every day or you have some plan to do it three or four days. I think that's the same thing with prayer, right. You kind of need to do it even when you're not. A lot of people, they know the benefits of exercise. So even when they don't feel like doing it right, they'll still get on the treadmill and they'll grunt their way through a half hour or whatever it is. And when they get done, they're like, man, I hated doing that, but I'm so glad I did it.
Sometimes that's like what prayer is, right? Like, I don't wake up every day saying, man, I cannot wait to get the money. Sometimes it's me trying to fit it in where I can. And, you know, I'm not, like, really feeling it. But after you did it, you're like, man.
So it reminded me. I don't know if it was St. Francis who said that, you know, everybody should be praying a half hour a day unless they're, like, really busy, stressed, and a lot is going on, and then they should pray an hour.
[00:24:55] Speaker B: Yeah, I don't remember who said that.
[00:24:56] Speaker D: I think there is a lot of truth to that state. So anyways, so I just want to make sure the exercise thing was, like, stressed, because I think that's really right. And by the way, if you go into the spiritual exercise, you don't dive right into an hour.
[00:25:10] Speaker C: Every spiritual director will start you at 10 minutes.
[00:25:13] Speaker D: They'll start you at 10 minutes and build you up slowly, just like you're exercising. As you get stronger with that, you move towards the hour. But the exercises themselves, there's four weeks, which is kind of confusing terminology because everybody thinks. But, like, a week is really like a movement. So a week can be anywhere in actuality from, you know, four weeks to 17 weeks, depending on what you're doing. And I know there's four weeks, but I actually think there's five movements, right? Because there's the Disposition Days, which is a movement where Ignatius is making sure you know how loved you are by God, right, For who you are, for the good, the bad, and the ugly. You know, God loves you. And that is, like, hammered in on that. Which is good, because then the first official week of the exercises is sin week, right, where we're examining not just our sin, but how we've been sinned against.
Kind of structural. I mean, sin is all around us, right? It is all around us, sometimes more obvious than not. But that's what that is. Just to make us, like, aware, not to make us feel super guilty, but just so we. We know where sin is in the world. So that's the first movement. And then the second movement, which is the longest of the four weeks or four movements, is where we follow Jesus in his ministry. And I think that's really cool. Right?
[00:26:38] Speaker B: Those are my favorite.
[00:26:39] Speaker D: Yeah, yeah. The wedding, all that stuff.
And I think it's almost the most. In a lot of ways, it's the most important movement because that's where you really grow closer to Christ. You're following him. You're seeing him in action. You're seeing him help a couple homeless people. And then you say, I want to be just like you when I grow up. That's the object of the second week there.
So they go through the second week, and then the third week is the Passion, the death of Jesus. And the second week, I think, feeds into that because now you've grown closer to Jesus. You love him, you want to be just like him when you grow up, you've really established this relationship, and then you have to watch him get arrested, suffer torture, and die, right? And so the idea of this third week is that you are there in this suffering with Jesus, and now in a very special way, because you've grown so close to him, right? And, you know, I. I remember I'm not a guy who cries, right? I'm your typical male Right. I don't want to shed too many tears here, but I can remember just.
And you're not even thinking the resurrection yet? Because I think the key to that.
[00:27:59] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:28:00] Speaker D: Is like, not get to the end of the story. Like, you know, I know a lot of people are like, well, Jesus is God, and, you know, he knew he was going to go to heaven and blah, blah, blah. But that does not minimize what he went through. Because I always tell everybody, if you think about it, we're in the same boat.
We know we're going to heaven. We know all that. But that doesn't make our life and our suffering any easier. I always tell people, I am not afraid of death, but I am afraid of dying. Like the process, you see people, Alzheimer's or cancer, it's either too long or it's too quick or it's too. You know, the dying process isn't easy. And so we are there sharing that with Jesus and the very sorrow of.
[00:28:47] Speaker C: What'S going on, really staying with Jesus at the foot of the cross and not rushing ahead. No, that's the call of the third week and Holy Week.
[00:28:56] Speaker D: Yes, absolutely.
[00:28:57] Speaker C: Is to go really deeply into those.
[00:28:59] Speaker D: Difficult moments, that solemn time you talked about on Good Friday. Right. I mean, that's really what we're in there. Right.
[00:29:07] Speaker B: I think during the year after I did the exercises is when Good Friday took a whole different meaning, and venerating the cross took a whole different meaning rather than a monotonous thing that Catholics do on Good Friday.
[00:29:24] Speaker D: Right.
[00:29:25] Speaker B: You know, it's. Because I was there.
[00:29:28] Speaker D: Yeah. Oh, yeah. And I mean, I think that's true of our faith all the time.
[00:29:31] Speaker B: Right.
[00:29:32] Speaker D: The more we understand why we're doing something, the deeper it becomes. Like when I do a baptism, I know. In a private setting. When I do a baptism in a private setting, I take 10 to 15 minutes to say, here's what we're going to do. And this is what it means. This is why we're doing the sign of the cross on the child's forehead. This is what the first anointing means. This is what the baptism itself means. This is what the sacred.
By doing that and understanding the symbolism, I think it can draw everybody more into the mystery and the beauty of what's happening. And I think that's exactly what you're saying. Right. After experiencing the exercises, this Holy Week takes on a whole different perspective, and you just really get deep into it. So that's the third week, and then the fourth week is. That's the joyous one. Right. The resurrection.
Jesus rises and visits people and talks to them, and that's where we're like, yeah, I want to experience that part, too. Right.
[00:30:34] Speaker C: Cool. All right. So that's, like, the exercises in, I don't know, five minutes to talk about it.
So getting back to the passion narratives and just, you know, the story of Jesus's last week on Earth in general, do you two have. I don't want to say a favorite part, because that's.
[00:30:53] Speaker D: Yes.
[00:30:56] Speaker C: But a piece of that story that maybe is special to you.
[00:31:02] Speaker D: You want me to go first? Yeah, you're our guest. You had warned me about this question beforehand, which is great, because it was, like, a wonderful opportunity for me to think, because I had never really thought about that before. Right. So I really had to sit there.
[00:31:14] Speaker C: It's overwhelming because you're looking at the whole two chapters at once. Right?
[00:31:17] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, there's a lot going on.
[00:31:19] Speaker D: Yeah, there's a lot. There's a lot going on in there. And I kind of came up with, like, two favorite parts. And I realized one of my favorite parts isn't even in the Luke or the John, because my first favorite part is when Jesus is on the cross and he basically says, my God, my God, why have you abandoned me? That's my favorite part. Because I think for me, that always just shows how fully human Jesus is, and that the fact that he can wrestle and have doubts kind of with his faith in that moment, I think really should speak to all of us and say, you know, if Jesus can have doubts, we're free to wrestle with and have doubts, too. Right. That's part of the human experience. The fact that Jesus made himself so human that he experienced that. I love it, and I take affirmation in it, and it's one of my favorite parts. And I did not realize until I was preparing for this that it wasn't.
[00:32:15] Speaker C: At all Mark and Matthew. It must be in then, huh?
[00:32:18] Speaker D: Yeah, it's in Mark and Matthew. Because I'm looking through Luke and I'm like, wait a minute. Where's my favorite part?
[00:32:22] Speaker C: You don't get it at all. I don't get it.
[00:32:25] Speaker D: Yeah, I don't get it. I was like, so that was. So that was cool.
And I said, okay, so in case I do have to have something from Luke and John, my second favorite part is I'm always fascinated with the whole Pontius pilot.
[00:32:40] Speaker C: Oh, I can see that for you. Because the.
[00:32:43] Speaker D: Because of my, like, agnostic background, you know, and the fact that Pontius Pilate, you know, in a Lot of ways, you know, he's like, washing. He's not. He's not doing the stuff to Jesus. He's letting the crowd do it, right? He's like, hey. He's almost like saying, hey, I know you're an innocent guy, but my hands are tied. This is what the crowd wants to do. You know, that just really speaks to how a lot of times we live out our faith. Right. It's like, yeah, I would really love to evangelize to more people, but they don't want to hear it. I don't want to come off.
Yeah. So you hold it at arm's length. So just that whole Pontius Pilot interaction always just speaks to me and gets me to thinking and, like, you know, how in my life am I, like, conscious pilot? Right. You know what I think about? It happens a lot because we try.
[00:33:38] Speaker B: To rationalize our decisions to not be as bad as they were, right?
[00:33:43] Speaker D: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[00:33:44] Speaker B: You know, and that's why the sacrament of reconciliation is so intimidating to people, because you actually have to acknowledge. And you can't rational. You can't rationalize with the priest. Like, oh, well, I didn't really mean to say that because you're being held accountable. And there was no one there for Pilate to be held accountable.
[00:34:04] Speaker D: And how many of us sit there and go, man, if I lived back then, I would have never been part of that crowd that wanted to crucify Jesus. I would have been, you know, I would have been across the street counter protesting or something. But, you know, chances are we would have been a part of that. Yeah, yeah, yeah, right.
[00:34:22] Speaker C: How about you?
[00:34:23] Speaker B: Do you have a. Yeah. You know, one of our.
One of the things during this week is we see a lot of Jesus humanity and divinity at the same time.
And similar to you, Eric, mine is when he's at Gethsemane and he gets mad at the disciples for falling asleep because he knows the monstrosity that's going to happen. And he's getting so mad at them because they're just like, oh, I'm tired. I'm gonna go to sleep. And then even more, the humanity, like, why do I have to do this? And that. That crying and the. The conversation and prayer that he had with God, it's just like, why are you making me do this? And I think that's the.
I see Jesus more. It's weird because we've had this conversation, like images of Jesus. Jesus is my buddy. He's my friend. He walks alongside me. So, like, I. I really relate to the Humanness of Jesus, the divinity part is where I struggle sometimes, you know, because it's. It's Anyway.
But knowing that he even, like, similar to what you said, you know, he struggled too.
[00:35:38] Speaker D: And how cool is it that he can actually get angry?
[00:35:40] Speaker B: Yeah, right.
[00:35:40] Speaker C: I mean, because it was that.
[00:35:41] Speaker B: And then when he tipped over the tables, I think those are the only two times. And I could be wrong, but.
[00:35:49] Speaker C: Well, yeah, I think we use the phrase, like, we wrestle with things a lot in this conversation. And I think the Holy Week is all about that, Right? Like wrestling with Jesus's humanity and his divinity. Like in that. That scene from the Garden of Gethsemane. Like, it isn't even. Like his. His divinity and his humanity are at odds because he was a whole. Right. So to him, it was all integrated. But because he was divine, he knew where things were going sometimes, sometimes, not all the time. Right.
[00:36:20] Speaker B: But he was so scared.
[00:36:23] Speaker C: He experienced it all the emotions, anger, but also hurt at that moment and betray. I mean, we can't even probably name all the emotions Jesus felt in that moment or in any of these moments in Holy Week, which I think is.
[00:36:37] Speaker D: Wonderful, because when we're asking Christ to be with us, something bad is going on. We know he's experienced fear and doubt and sadness and, you know, all those things that were. That we're experiencing. And yet he's able to put his arms around us and say, yeah, I've experienced that.
But guess what?
[00:36:58] Speaker C: Yeah, that moment of like, just take it. If you can take it, just take it. Right? I mean, we can all. Yes, everyone has been there.
[00:37:04] Speaker B: What about you, Ann?
[00:37:05] Speaker C: Okay, so mine.
Yeah, mine, likewise. We don't actually read either on Palm Sunday or on Good Friday, but it is the Gospel for the Monday of Holy Week. And it is the sort of. The anointing at Bethany is my favorite because it. And it's told a little bit differently in the Gospels, but the story, it happens at least I think in John's Gospel, it's like the night before Palm Sunday. So it's like the last thing that happens with Jesus before he goes into Jerusalem. And, you know, we set off the whole. All the events of Holy Week that lead to his death and resurrection. But it is in John's Gospel, the woman who anoints Jesus's feet with the expensive oil and dries them with her hair is named as Mary of Bethany. So she's the sister of Martha and of Lazarus, who's. Who Jesus has just raised. She's not named in the other three gospels, but in John, she is. And I just love that story because out of everybody who knew Jesus, she was the only one who understood where he was going, and she gave everything to say goodbye to him.
[00:38:26] Speaker D: And how cool is it that it was a woman?
It wasn't Peter. It wasn't Peter, the top. The. You know, the top of us or the TED guy that did it or any of that. It was a woman who.
[00:38:36] Speaker C: She.
[00:38:37] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:38:37] Speaker C: And she. She. She was the only one who saw him clearly. She was the only one who saw him clearly. And she got, you know, judged for it.
[00:38:44] Speaker D: Yeah. Yeah.
[00:38:45] Speaker C: It's such a powerful moment.
[00:38:48] Speaker D: Can I pick that up as my favorite now?
[00:38:50] Speaker C: Yeah, I'll share it. I'll share it.
[00:38:52] Speaker D: Let's go back and do this again. We'll rewind.
[00:38:56] Speaker C: Yeah, but I think you're going back to where we started with this whole conversation, like the parish passion narratives and everything that happened before Jesus's death. It's. It. It's worthwhile to even just take a few verses at once and maybe even not try to, like, if you get stuck on something, stay there. Like, that's God's calling you, to just, like, go deep with even a piece of that story, you know?
[00:39:20] Speaker D: And that's what Ignatius would tell you to do. Right. You read that, and if something.
Something you find your heart jumping or just something moving in your heart, that's the place to stop and think about it and reflect and pray on it. Yeah. Good stuff.
[00:39:37] Speaker C: So, Eric, we talked about preaching a little bit, and I was wondering if we could ask you, since I don't even know when you're preaching this triduum, which of the services you'll be doing?
[00:39:47] Speaker D: But normally I would be doing Holy Thursday, but I'm actually going to be out of town for most of the Holy Week, so I'm going to be. I'll be attending services elsewhere, but I'll be back for the Easter vigil.
[00:39:57] Speaker C: Okay.
[00:39:58] Speaker B: But normally I was gonna say you can't miss that.
[00:40:00] Speaker D: Yeah, normally I preach Holy Thursday.
[00:40:02] Speaker C: Okay.
[00:40:03] Speaker D: Cause Friday's a wonderful opportunity to have someone female preach, since it's not technically a mass. Right. So I love it when we have, you know, whether it's Sister Barbara Moore or whoever, preach Friday, and then, you know, usually Easter is the territory of the priest.
[00:40:19] Speaker C: Sure.
[00:40:20] Speaker D: I mean, I think Father Mike let me preach Easter once, and I pulled out a golf club, and he never let me do it again. I remember I did pull out a golf club. I did pull out a golf club. And so I never pre. But I never Preached it again. But I really think it's more the territory. I mean, that's really the priest territory. So I didn't have any problem with that. But it was, it was nice to be able to do that once. But Holy Thursday, I love preaching Holy Thursday because that's my fate. That's my, that's actually my favorite.
[00:40:45] Speaker C: Of the Tritium.
[00:40:46] Speaker D: Of the tritium, right?
[00:40:47] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:40:47] Speaker D: And it's because it's so diaconal. Right. I mean, I know that, you know, a lot of the perspective is this is the, you know, the institution of the Eucharist. But for me, the most powerful part of that whole thing was when Jesus washes the feet of his disciples, including Judas. Like he didn't get to Judas and say, not you, buddy. It was like he washed the feet of everybody. And I just think that is like so powerful. You know, a lot of times they say that, you know, how the deacon stole is cross. It was, that's really meant to symbolize, oh, the towel, the towel that Christ has around his, his waist right now.
[00:41:29] Speaker B: I have that piece of information.
[00:41:30] Speaker D: Yeah, it's just like, just like really, really powerful. And when I've had the opportunity to wash people's feet doing that, it's just.
[00:41:39] Speaker C: Like that is some of the most powerful stuff that happens all year in church is that moment of the foot.
[00:41:45] Speaker B: Washing on Holy Thursday at St. Catherine's when I first started at all the other churches I was at, it was always like a representation of 12 men up on the altar.
And then at St Catherine's they started to have people washing each other's feet.
So it was like the most beautiful moments is when the little kids take the pitcher of water and wash their parents feet. And that symbolism of just like, I'm taking care of you. And then we did that. Similarly, at my first year at transfig was the same thing as I had this one little girl and she's like, she came up, I washed her feet and then she looked at me, she goes, can I help you? And I'm like, yes, you can. And she stayed up with me the entire time and was so perfectly delicate with everybody and making sure that there was no wetness to their feet after. And it was just like, this is what it's about, you know. And some people are like, ew, I don't want my foot washed and my feet are gross or whatever. And you can always tell the people who have pedicures before.
[00:43:01] Speaker D: I think one of my homilies was about that. I talked about ugly feet, how In a lot of ways, our feet are symbolic of our souls, right? Because how many people, you know, the whole not worthy thing, and, you know, I don't want somebody seeing my soul or what's going to me. That's what our feet are all about, right? Ugly feet, good feet, smelly feet. Jesus is going to wash them all, right? And we have to be humble enough to let him do that. You know, for many years at transfiguration, we used to have the RCIA folks do that. And it would be so powerful for them, right? Because it would give them this whole lesson about, you know, coming into this relationship with Jesus. It's more about just praying and being in relationship. It's also acts of service and love. And when they would sit there and be washing the feet of, they would be in tears because it would just hit them what this faith meant to them.
[00:43:49] Speaker C: And how interesting that, you know, on Holy Thursday, Jesus did two things right. He instituted the Eucharist and he washed feet. And one of those things we do at every mass, and one of them we only do once a year. And what would our church in our world look like if we washed feet every day? If that was the practice, right? You know, I wonder that. Like, yeah, it is so powerful things to think about.
[00:44:16] Speaker D: But I always sit up there and it's always fun for me to watch how many people do not talk about.
[00:44:20] Speaker B: I know, I know.
[00:44:21] Speaker D: In fact, Marlene last year told me, because she has bunions and hope she's not watching.
[00:44:26] Speaker C: Oh, my gosh.
[00:44:27] Speaker B: You're gonna cut down a lot of.
[00:44:30] Speaker D: People, Jeff, if you need to edit this part out, I'll let you know.
But anyways, so, you know, she's always had these problems, and I don't think it's unusual for a lot of people. She's like, I'm not gonna go up and get my feet washed. Right? But then she gets into the service and she felt like. So moved, like she came up and did it, and it was just like. It was just. Yeah, beautiful. Is that one of those things that's gonna get me in trouble?
[00:44:52] Speaker C: Only with me.
[00:44:54] Speaker B: I know, right? Only with your wife.
[00:44:56] Speaker D: But I was just happy that she did it. And I think she knew and she felt she's been through the exercises. So sometimes she'll, you know, she'll succumb to this love of God, just like we.
[00:45:08] Speaker C: That's how grace goes.
[00:45:10] Speaker B: So the challenge then for Holy Thursday is if you haven't had the opportunity to have your foot washed or wash somebody's foot, this is Your go up this year?
[00:45:19] Speaker D: Absolutely.
[00:45:20] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:45:21] Speaker C: All right.
So we've been kind of dancing around this, just like everybody does during Holy Week, but we haven't talked about the cross much and the Paschal mystery and what, what is the meaning of what Jesus did on the cross? So, you know, not to put you on the spot, Eric, but how do you. How, how do you come at this whole, like, you know, this central moment?
[00:45:52] Speaker D: Yeah.
[00:45:53] Speaker C: And what, what it means for us as people who follow and love Jesus and, you know.
[00:46:02] Speaker D: Yeah, that was.
I mean, I think the Paschal mystery. I think mystery is the. Is the big word there, because I think it goes so much deeper than we can think about it. Like, I gotta tell you, like, just personally, I'm not a big fan of the whole atonement theory. Like, you know, this idea that Jesus created us sinful, and then because we go out and sin now, this angry God has to send Jesus down to. I mean, you know, there's a part of that in there, but to me is so much more. You know, I forget where I read it, but I, like, I love some guy who talked about. Really what that means is that Jesus, God came down to earth.
Jesus, we put our sins on him, right? I mean, because he was in the midst of all that sinful sinfulness that we talked about in the exercises, we put our sins on him, and as a result, he was arrested, suffered, died, but he did it all with love and forgiveness. So to me, the whole purpose of that was that Jesus reveals the heart of God.
That's how God feels about us, that we're loved, that we can be forgiven, that. That we are his child.
That's what I take out of it, right?
And to me, it's also that whole, the passion and everything that happens to me, it teaches us that we're going to live, we're going to suffer in our lives. I don't think anybody gets away from suffering, that we're going to die, but then we are going to rise again, right? To me, that's. We all need hope. That's what I think the Paschal mystery does, is it gives us that hope that there is more. Right. I think that's why I was just deaconed at a funeral Monday. And to me, nobody does funerals like Catholics do because we understand that, right? There's this beautiful mix of sadness and grief with hope at the same time. All at the same time, right? All at the same time. So tears are flowing, but at the same time, there's hope. And, you know, I just think that, you know, Catholic funerals pull the Paschal mystery together for us in a very real way when we're there experiencing it. So I don't know if that's very clear, but I don't know how to. Clearly, it's just like, so.
It's so deep.
[00:48:47] Speaker C: We've talked to you before about, like, how the Paschal mysteries, it's not just Good Friday and Easter Sunday. It's like Jesus's whole life because from the moment he was born, he was gonna. He was going to die. Like God was going to die. So whether it was the cross is a symbol and it teaches us something about how God loves. But just the fact that he was God and human.
[00:49:14] Speaker D: Yeah.
[00:49:15] Speaker C: Changes everything.
[00:49:16] Speaker D: Yeah. And to me, I think that's what the New Testament is all about. Right. Because I don't know about you, I read the Old Testament and this God is smiting, killing, And I'm like, oh, my God, read that. It's like, who would want to follow this God? But I always feel like the New Testament is Jesus coming down to reveal what God is really about to say. Look, it. The Old Testament has some value and a lot of discipline and stuff to be learned, but this is what I am really about. Right. Love and relationship. And Jesus, as you said, gave us that through his whole life, which is wonderful.
[00:49:53] Speaker C: Yeah. I was trying to look for ways to explain this, and the closest I've come. Did you ever read Ronald Rolheiser? He's got a book I talked about called the Passion and the Cross and his image. Similar to what you were saying, Eric, about, like, going deeper than atonement theology. Right. Is like, he's getting it. Like, what do we mean when we say that Jesus took away the sins of the world and he uses the image of, like, a water filter?
And so what he says, what happens on the cross is that Jesus held and carried all of the sin and all of the hurt and all of the darkness. And he didn't pass it on. He transformed it within himself and he gave back only love. And that was the image that really meant a lot to me. And, you know, so I'm just gonna quote this is from. You can find it on. He has several blogs that talk about this. But he says Jesus took in hatred, held it, transformed it, and gave back love. He took in bitterness, held it, transformed it, and gave back graciousness. He took in curses, held them, transformed them, and gave back blessing.
He took in murder, held it, transformed it, and gave back forgiveness.
And then he goes on to say, and what Jesus wants isn't admiration. He wants imitation. So that's like, that's what really got me. He's like. Because we all deal with tension, he says, like, in our workplaces, in our families, in our lives. And if we're going to be Christians, if we're going to take in all of that, but not pass it on.
[00:51:38] Speaker D: Yeah.
[00:51:39] Speaker C: Ooh, man.
[00:51:40] Speaker D: And wasn't that last rescue? I mean, isn't that the whole love your enemies thing? Right. Which is hard to do, but that's.
[00:51:47] Speaker C: So that's an image that I have taken to help think about what the cross means.
[00:51:56] Speaker B: I like that image. I never thought about it that way. The only thing that came close would be, you know, the prayer of St. Francis, make me an instrument of your peace. And that's how I, you know, perceive the Paschal mystery. Like where there is something that is an injustice, flip it around.
[00:52:20] Speaker D: But I really like that. And I think that's what our faith. That's what we're always working towards.
[00:52:27] Speaker C: Right, right.
[00:52:29] Speaker D: Strengthening that filter or making it even stronger in more parts of our lives. Yeah, I really like that image.
[00:52:36] Speaker B: That is a good image. It just caught my attention, though. When we do take that, it's not that we're sheltering people from hurt or sadness or despair, but that the understanding of hope.
I think sometimes we can get into this image of Jesus didn't shelter us from all that. He experienced it with us, but was able to transform it into something even better than what we had originally intended.
[00:53:08] Speaker C: Right. And so Jesus comes to earth to draw close to us in our suffering, and Holy Week is the time we can draw close to him and his suffering.
[00:53:17] Speaker D: Right.
[00:53:17] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:53:18] Speaker D: It's not that Jesus is always like, I always get frustrated sometimes when I see some of these ministers that are like prosperity theology. Like, if you grow closer to God or you donate to the church, whatever, then good things are going to happen and you'll be taken care of. Where? I think the message of this week is that we can't avoid. Suffering is a part of life. But the important thing is not that Jesus is going to take care of us in the sense that he's going to solve all our problems, but Jesus is going to take care of it in the sense that God will be there with us in our suffering. Right.
And give us that hope that eventually there will be something better.
[00:54:00] Speaker C: There we go.
[00:54:02] Speaker D: That's good stuff.
[00:54:03] Speaker C: Okay, well, final things you want to say about Holy Week or anything else, you know?
[00:54:09] Speaker D: No, my only emphasis would be exactly what you said.
Sit in the grace of Holy Week. Don't rush through it. Don't, you know, do the tritium. That's all one big Mass. Do all three of them. I think people miss out if they, like, go to Holy Thursday and then they can't make Friday or. And, like, I know a lot of people don't like to do the Easter vigil because it's the best. You know, it's like, oh, yeah, it's the mother of all Masses. Right. It is like. And even though I know it's like an hour and a half or two hours, it is just, like, so beautiful. And, like, what's really cool, speaking of rcia, because, you know, that's where. When. When the kids or the adults are getting baptized or receiving their sacraments, that's the Mass where they get it at. And so I'll always look out. And, like, 95% of the people that are at the Easter vigil are people who went through RCIA or somebody who sponsored them through RCIA or there's some connection with RCIA there because it is such a beautiful and special Mass. So I would tell people, if you haven't experienced that, absolutely. Go to.
Is just the candles and the sink. Oh, it's just.
[00:55:18] Speaker C: It's beautiful.
[00:55:19] Speaker B: And this year, we have two teens that are going to be baptized and make their first communion and confirmation, and they are so excited.
And it's just. Yeah.
[00:55:34] Speaker D: And then, like I said, our adult Huntley, he just. He's ready for the Eucharist.
[00:55:38] Speaker C: Oh, yeah. Come celebrate with us.
[00:55:39] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:55:40] Speaker D: It's going to be great. That is so cool. Yes, yes, yes.
[00:55:43] Speaker C: All right. Well, thank you for being here.
[00:55:45] Speaker D: Oh, I love it.
[00:55:45] Speaker C: Invite me back sometime.
[00:55:47] Speaker D: Invite me back. I love doing stuff like this.
[00:55:50] Speaker C: Oh, anytime. Anytime.
[00:55:52] Speaker D: Other than getting in trouble with my wife, I think pretty good. And we're gonna have Jeff edit that part, so I might not get in that much trouble.
[00:56:01] Speaker B: You owe her a pedicure now.
[00:56:05] Speaker D: She is beautiful. Her feet are like. That's.
[00:56:08] Speaker C: Maybe we should have Marlene on as a guest.
[00:56:10] Speaker D: Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
[00:56:13] Speaker B: That could get interesting.
[00:56:14] Speaker D: She'd be really.
[00:56:15] Speaker C: She'd be great.
[00:56:16] Speaker D: She'd be. Well, she's my editor in chief for homilies.
[00:56:19] Speaker C: Yes.
[00:56:19] Speaker D: Right. So I really do value her. Yo. Well, you know, because you could write a homily, and I could think, I know what I'm saying, or that something makes sense.
[00:56:28] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:56:29] Speaker D: But I would never want to give a homily without getting another pair of eyes on it to. To say, yeah, that I understand what you're saying. And the thing about wives is they do not hold back. Right. Nobody's gonna say, well, this is the deacon. I don't want to hurt his feelings. My wife, if I, you know, something isn't making sense or I can't tell you how many times she'll hand something to me. I'm like, this just doesn't speak to me like, oh, do better.
Put so much time into this in.
[00:56:56] Speaker B: The most loving way.
[00:56:57] Speaker D: Yeah. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. And which. Which is beautiful in itself because it actually gets us in a wonderful discussion. Because sometimes I go right up to the edge on homilies and the topics that I'll pick, and she might come up and say, you know, this might get some people upset, or I think you're getting into some territory that maybe.
[00:57:17] Speaker C: That'S when you double down.
[00:57:18] Speaker D: Well, and that's when I'm like, I know, but this is what the spirit's calling me to preach. Right. I remember when I did the one on sex abuse.
[00:57:26] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:57:26] Speaker D: I remember she wanted me to change. She thought that was gonna be, like, really hard for a lot of people to listen to, and it is. And so she wanted me to change it to some other, like, cry or something else. And I was like, no, this is. You know, the spirit's really calling me to this. And I think this is gonna move people and move people one way or the other. And as a homilist, like, I don't care. Like, when people come up and they're really upset with the homily I've given, I'm almost as proud of that fact as when they come up and they love it.
[00:57:56] Speaker C: You're really good at having a thick skin about those things.
[00:57:58] Speaker D: Well, but the thing is, if they come up and they're really upset and they're telling me what they disagree with, one, that tells me they listened through the whole thing and they're thinking about it, which is all any homilist wants you to do. Right. The worst thing you could say to a homilist is like, what did you just preach? Right. So I love that. And two, I love the courage that it takes. It's really easy to tell somebody, yeah, I loved your homily. But if somebody comes up and says, you know, I really didn't like this part, that takes some courage, and I always admire that, too. So, yeah, for sure. Yeah.
[00:58:29] Speaker B: Well, thank you for being you.
[00:58:30] Speaker D: Oh, well, that.
Don't quite know how to answer that one. But, yes, you're welcome. Thank you for being you.
[00:58:39] Speaker C: And thank you.
[00:58:41] Speaker D: Thank you for being here.
[00:58:42] Speaker B: I feel like I'm on the Teletubbies.
[00:58:44] Speaker D: Now for listening to us being us.
[00:58:47] Speaker C: Yeah. So we hope you have a great Holy Week. Come and hang out with us at church as much as you can.
And next week we will be in Easter Easter people.
So, yeah, have a great week everybody, and we'll see you next time.
[00:59:04] Speaker B: Bye bye.
[00:59:06] Speaker A: Thanks for taking a faith break with us today.
Karen Luke and Ann Gallagher are lay ministers with the parishes of of St. Catherine of Siena in Menden, New York, and Church of the Transfiguration in Pittsford, New York. More about our parishes, including weekly live streamed Sunday Mass can be
[email protected] or transfigurationpittsford.org thanks to our special guest today, Deacon Eric Bissette. Engineering today is by Jeff Beckett. Join us for new episodes of Faith Break each week in Studio on YouTube or on your favorite audio podcast or music app.
